Perhaps the most confusing impact Tim Ferris’s “4 Hour Work Week” ideology has made on the online business world is the idea that ultimate success is near-total separation from the company you’ve built.
Someday, the concept implies, you could be so successful that you’ll have a small army of (largely low-paid) people running your business for you while you spend your time doing… whatever ultra-successful fancy people do in their spare time.
Which, according to my Instagram research, appears to be a lot of taking selfies on private jets and making noisy instagram stories from the shores of private beaches.
While Ferris has since begun distancing himself from this philosophy, along with the culture of hyper-productivity and self-optimization he once espoused (growth, people!), we can see echoes of the impact of this line of thinking everywhere we go in online biz world.
The Legendary Four-Hour, Fully-Auto Biz
Create products for passive income! Set it up once, and do nothing – and make money while you sleep!
Outsource everything humanly possible! Doing stuff is for peasants! Responding to your emails? Posting on social? Taking care of clients? Calling grandma? OUTSOURCE.
And, my personal favorite:
Get so good, and so visible, eventually you won’t have to sell anything ever! People will just buy!
Ah, that last part. THE DREAM.
The glorious mirage in the desert of digital marketing that we chase constantly: that someday, our need to sell, and even show up, will be over.
Everything will fill up with one post on Instagram without us even selling conspicuously (or something, idk, it’s a fantasy — not a screenplay), while all your funnels do the heavy lifting without needing to be touched or tinkered with ever…
… And your excellence will be reflected in your effortlessness.
Waiting for Godot
But (of course there’s a but)…
That’s uh… not quite how it works.
And of course, this line of thinking isn’t unique to business!
You see echoes of it in the arts world as well — in the myth that if you’re so talented, and so attractive, you’ll never have to pound the pavement because some producer will grab you by the arm on Rodeo Drive and “discover you”.
And therein also lies the insinuation that if you’re trying really hard, pounding on doors and putting yourself out there for any and every opportunity, you must be some kind of loser.
Or worse… a salesman.
And so, when we tie this type of “above-ness” to our own line of thinking, and genuinely start believing that because we’re so different, we’re never going to have to be like those people… it becomes easy to judge others for their efforts.
Playing Office-Chair Quarterback
I can’t count the number of times I personally turned my nose up at strategies and tactics I hadn’t personally tried over the last ~10 years (i.e. “Why does everyone send so many emails when they’re launching? Gross.” or “Soandso is always selling. If it’s good, you shouldn’t have to try that hard.”, or “I’d never hire a coach — I don’t wanna pay for a friend,”) — not because my intentions were bad, or even that I was wrong about everything.
But I thought that after a while, being, like, REALLY successful wasn’t about testing and trying stuff and getting messy — but rather about being in exactly the right place, at exactly the right time, with exactly the right offer.
Shoulda Listened to Coach Instead
Eventually, I got closer to some awesome human beings who are ultra-successful in the online space, while keeping their integrity high, and their presence in the business strong.
And I watched them do the things I thought they were supposed to be “above” at their level.
Like selling well and often to their email lists and social feeds.
Like daring to test new offers and drop ’em when they didn’t work.
Like rolling up their sleeves to create things alongside their team.
And like pouring well-worthwhile cash into their own growth and education.
Now, this is NOT to say that I recommend going full chaotic neutral and just “try everything”!
(Pyramid schemes? Super aggressive sales tactics? Lying to your customers? Who cares, ANARCHY!)
However. The further along you get in business, and the bigger your dreams, it becomes essential to to interrogate what you’re resistant to.
Are You REALLY Too Good for That…or Just Deflecting?
What ARE you actually “too good” for — and what are you avoiding because you’re not sure you’ll do it right, or that you don’t know how to apply certain strategies in a way that makes sense for your business?
As you might have predicted: we get into all of this AND MORE on today’s #HAMYAW.
Click here to catch the episode, and find out:
- Margo’s take on the pervasive “myth of discovery’
- Why so many of us play “business armchair quarterback”
- Why it’s so essential to understand your values
- How we feel about things like speaking for free, or being featured on podcasts with small audiences
- What to do when that little “I’m too good for this!” voice pops into your head
- AND – in the final act, a brief mention of the way we misinterpret what “generosity” really is.
And while you’re over there, let us know:
What are YOU too good for?
Similarly: what have you eaten humble pie around when it comes to your growth?
We wanna know about it ALL — so head on over to YouTube, and we’ll catch you in the comments.
Write on,
H
Episode Transcript
He was like, “Oh it’s all about money, money, money for y’all.” I was like, “Yes, I run a business? I’m not running a charity. You must be new here.”
(upbeat music)
Welcome back marketing nerds of the world. It’s time for another episode of HAMYAW, and today we wanna talk about things you think you’re better than in online business.
That’s right folks. At some point in your journey you are gonna look around at the industry and dismiss certain practices outright, stick your nose up at strategies, and then all of a sudden, one day you’re realizing that “oh, no” you have to use them, and maybe those people had a point.
It is a very embarrassing reckoning to have with yourself and the life of yourself as an entrepreneur. But I wanna let you all know it is normal. And we wanna dig into a little bit today, what are you actually too good for? And what are you dismissing outright because you don’t fully understand it or you don’t know how to adapt it to yourself.
These problems usually fall into two categories, pricing, and strategy. So what more we dig into/ We’re not too good for a Margo. What are you too good for?
Oh my God. I’m just so guilty of this. Anyone watching, who has like an academic
or liberal arts or arts background, we are so guilty of feeling like certain strategies are below us especially when it comes to sales.
Yeah.
They’re like, Oh no, we’re like me. Don’t do things like that. And in fairness, in defense of us, this is part of how we’re indoctrinated. I’m so curious actually, to find out this happened to you. But like this was said directly to me, when I showed an interest in marketing, people will be like, “Margo you’re smarter than that.” Like you’re not.
No, I’m not. Don’t worry.
Or I think it’s related to you’re smarter than that. And then there’s the myth of discovery.
So it is sold to us through movies, TV, like stories of our friends, where you think that if you are good enough, people will just find you, and that if you’re beautiful enough, you walk through a mall and a modeling agent is like, Oh, you, you were the face of Givenchy. It’s like, that’s not how it works people.
So we have like a profound misconception about the hard work, perseverance, and strategy required to get to where we want to go. But I think we’re rooted in this idea that we shouldn’t have to work hard for it, talent is natural, and that if we were really good, that, like, we wouldn’t have to do these things.
Yes.
Because that’s for people who are below us. That’s for the scums of the earth.
People who aren’t as talented as us. Aren’t as smart, basically for the peasants is what I’m saying. And ultimately I’ve come to accept with Gusto that I am in fact, a peasant and proud, and it has been a wonderful motor for my business, and I think Margo, I love
that you brought this up because I also think there is a degree, especially when you’re not in the arena, as they would say, to be dismissive of certain sales tactics and certain ways people are pricing themselves, and I know this because I’ve literally written these pieces guys.
For a number of years, I was a copywriter and I was on the inside of these businesses that I was seeing problems and I was talking about them, and I actually think it was an important discussion to bring to light, especially the post I made around pricing which I kind of should go back and add an addendum to all these years later.
But I think what is interesting about the journey of entrepreneurship as well is that when you step out of kind of trading time for dollars being a service provider you actually have to get into selling things and things that cost lots of money, the game changes, and all of a sudden you start looking around and being like “Oh crap”, like all those things, I was dismissing outright as dumb or clunky or out of date. Now I’m using them because guess what? They work, and that’s the worst part about it all. I think at the end of the day.
It’s not the worst, it’s humbling, it’s not bad.
Which is the worst. That’s synonymous for me.
Fair. But Hilary I wanna draw a distinction, here, we’re not saying, Oh my God I thought this was deceptive and douchey, and now am deceptive and douchey. That is not what we’re saying. We are douchey. No, just kidding. But I think there’s a distinction between having an aversion to something you have never tried.
Yes.
Having your spidey sense go off when a moral violation, an ethical violation is truly happening in your field.
Yes.
And so when you have that frame of like, I’m better than this, it’s really hard to distinguish between the two, and I think your metaphor of the arena is apropos because once you step into the arena, it’s really clear what things you need to do because you just need to get it done, and what things are deceptive practices that you’re not gonna touch. But when you’re on the cheap seats in the peanut gallery, you can just critique everything. Like it’s so easy to look at, I don’t know sports, but like, you can see where the kicker could have caught the ball better or whatever,
Kickers don’t catch the ball, Margo.
Metaphors, you know.
Someday I’ll teach you football, but you’re absolutely right. It’s the armchair quarterback, and it’s like, “Oh, well you should run faster. He keeps winning the game with his legs.” It’s like, how many beers have you drank sitting there in your Lazy Boy? You sure you know about what this game is like on the ground? Feeling frustrated with people being like, “Oh, how did he miss that? Blah, blah, blah. Is he blind?” And again, you’re right. It is so easy to go around and critique but then all of a sudden you’re on the field and you realize, Oh.
And that there’s a lot more going on. So let’s take some more concrete examples.
Like one of the things I hear a lot in my coaching practice is people will go. I just don’t wanna do like click-baity, SEO articles. And I’m like, okay, well, first of all, you do, if you want traffic. Second of all, let’s define those because I think people, what they mean when they say that is I don’t want lazy writing. And I agree you should not write lazily.
But having a content strategy with like ideas that are well-organized is a wonderful thing. Now, insulting your readers by making something diluted, simplistic, and pounded with keywords? Yeah, that’s disrespectful.
Yeah.
You do ultimately want your content to be found. So you’re not better than SEO by making a headline that is impossible to search for, right? Let’s be clear on what this is, using clickbait for what matters. So clickbait in its inception was created as something
to entice you to click. That can be a really positive thing.
Yeah.
If this thing it’s enticing you to click retains your attention, teaches you something, pulls you into a useful funnel that solves your problem. Where it’s problematic is when it’s used and exploited by the ad model, right?
You won’t believe what happens next.
Yeah, exactly where, no truly I worked, worked for some of these organizations. I for free gave my labor to companies where they really only expect their readers to read the first or second paragraph, and then after that they don’t edit and they don’t care and they don’t expect you to read and they are using other clickbait to take you off the page.
That’s qualitatively different from what we’re talking about. So when you feel like you’re better than this, I would challenge you, especially in the issue of content and SEO and that as a strategy, to lean into that discomfort and really figure out what’s going on. Like, are you uncomfortable for the right reasons? Or are you uncomfortable because it’s forcing you to define your brand?
Yes, oh my God. I love that point, and I have a client of mine, Daniela LaFave, who’s fabulous. Follow her on Instagram, she’s fantastic. She’s the SEO of Sea Witch, I just love her. And part of what she does with her work is helping creatives who are in hyper-creative fields. So creative service providers, copywriters designers, and also coaches, consultants, healers, all those cats.
She helps them use SEO without losing their voice, and she’s trying to defeat the myth that SEO is about stuffing keywords under the mattress and hiring a guy named Josh to optimize your website and then you have, you paid him $20,000 and you have no idea what he did and he’s bringing in a bunch of leads, but they’re all steel manufacturing, and you’re like, “Well how did you get here?”
Anyway, and she talks about that a lot because her frustration as well, maybe copywriters are just sassy by nature, but she’s looking around and she’s like I wish copywriters understood SEO.
It’s every time they make a critique of it, I realized they actually don’t fully understand how the system works, and I think that there’s a lot of temptation especially in the field to be the critic. To feel like you’re so above it all, and I have lived this, so I can speak freely about it.
But ultimately I think that what the pot of gold at the end of the rainbow is, is the ability to look at the strategy. Like, okay, what is this helping people do? What can it help me do? And what is my aversion to do it? Is it that it’s really not a fit for my values? Or have I seen it done in ways that violate my values? And is there a better way to do it?
Yes, I think that’s such a good point. I think number one, we need understanding, awareness, and alignment of our values with our behavior. And I don’t know if we arrive at the table with this. I’m curious, your thoughts at this.
Yeah, definitely not.
If you would have told me I didn’t know who I was and I didn’t know what I valued, I would have told you to like walk off a short cliff.
You don’t know what you don’t know.
Yeah.
That’s the thing too.
Yeah.
I think it’s, you gotta be conscious of the stage that you’re at. This is something funny, ‘cause I’ve been seeing this in my Power Position coaching clients a lot. Because I did my last launch and I had a couple of Instagram stories where I was like putting on makeup and talking about the offer and then like putting on skincare and people went nuts for it, and I was like, “Oh cool. This is great.” So for me, what was handy about it was I was like, “Okay can I walk and chew gum at the same time?”
Yeah.
Like, it was like a fun challenge for me to just be off the cuff and talk and, because I’m into this offer.
Yeah.
And I know it inside out, ’cause I do it every single day. But what was interesting about it is I had a lot of people on calls being like, I don’t wanna do the traditional launch. I want to launch it the way you do it. Like doing makeup on Instagram. It feels casual and feels organic, and I will tell you guys that I did not do a casual organic the first two launches. I played by the rules, I played by the system that I used to critique.
Which is, you know, you have the lead magnet, you bring them in through the traditional like seven email sequence and you do all of these things, and I did it because I needed to understand what was working and what was not. It gives you a structure that you can measure the effectiveness of which is always handy, and I think to get to a really unique place in your strategy, you have to do it by the book first.
Yeah.
Because then you can realize what of the structure you don’t need, so you can pare it down and do it your way. But you’ve got to humble yourself and go through that general
stereotypical launch pattern first, often, to figure out what you don’t want. And there are coaches out there who will help you figure out your unique launch protocol yourself. Rachael Tuner another client of mine, fantastic.
Yeah.
But for the rest of us who don’t get to work with Rachael, it is really a matter of painting by numbers first and then messing around with your blank canvas.
Totally I mean, you could also do what I did and I do not recommend this. Which is, arrive at the same conclusion with far less sales and far less effort and get so dissuaded that you have to call your friends and become the encumbering person.
You’re not an encumbering person, I disrespect that. No, absolutely not.
I’m actually not sure if this is when we were close, but like I sent one email and nothing happened.
Oh, yeah we were close.
Devastated.
Yeah, it sucks.
And I think, again, what you were saying about sequencing is really important too because it sometimes takes that humbling where I would think like, well, I am at this certain point. It’s like, okay, but you’re still a human running a business. Like you didn’t suddenly shit rainbows where you don’t have to put muscle in. Like even the people at Nike got to give promotions, there are still sales happening. You don’t suddenly reach a point where you’re magically not selling.
Yes, you sell in a different way.
Yeah, absolutely, so this idea that we’re above anything… and we touched on this y’all, if you watched our post-pandemic, like that first week of the pandemic, panic in the pandemic episode I think it was called. Hillary and I touched on the other side of this was believing that you’re above doing that work that brought you your business and built it in the first place that you wanted to move past.
So if you’re a freelancer who now has a scalable business, like having to rest on those laurels, wanting to rest on those laurels, like sometimes you do have to go back and eat shit. And like that is part of being a business owner, and so I think like that, I want to distinguish that from things that we truly are beyond instead of above.
I think that that is the reframe that is most helpful. ‘Cause I remember when someone told me like, aren’t you above doing podcasts that don’t have any audiences? And I was like, that is so mean and disrespectful. Like, first of all, you get reps from that.
Yeah.
And one day you’ll be at the point where you’re so in demand that you can say no to things like that. But like most people I know that do book launches that are really, really big, they just say yes to every, it’s a blitz. It’s a blitz, no matter how big you are and how many best-selling books you have, honestly, they will go on anything because it catches them two more people.
So I don’t think that that’s scalable, but when I say beyond, an example I have is, actually you and I both have been in a situation where people would ask us to talk for free, and that was really hard because when you’re building up your speaking repertoire, you’re doing a lot of that stuff for free or on some sort of barter system. And there does come a point where you’re like this is not a good use of my time anymore. But it’s not because you’re above it. You’ve graduated beyond it.
Yeah.
And it doesn’t make sense anymore, and it makes sense that you charge for certain things and then certain things maybe are charity or volunteer but you’re not better than it.
No, I liked that you made that distinction because I think it’s, “Aren’t you beyond that?” And I think actually the line moves more than you think around what you’re too good for. And I’ve been promoted to being like, well you have like a really recognizable brand, you don’t have to sell anymore.
And I was like, Ooh, let me tell you. I sell literally every single day because I think that there’s this weird subconscious belief in the industry that once you get to a certain level of visibility or like Instagram followers or whatever, or like email list, blah blah. If your internet penis is 10,000 people large then you’re automatically gonna sell out of everything and be a millionaire.
And then you can just sort of, as you say, rest on your laurels. I think that that is kind of a myth. That someday you’re gonna get so big at some point, you don’t have to sell it. As a business, you are always gonna have to sell them. I’m glad that you brought up Nike. ‘Cause it’s like, even Nike does promotions, right?
Even Gucci is on, sometimes running sales. But I think that as business owners we need to learn to embrace that as opposed to seeing it as gauche, as opposed to seeing it as ultimately a strategy that you’re not going to have to sell anymore you will always have to sell but you will be able to do it in a different more creative way, which is something I really enjoy, and I’m experimenting with right now. But it never really leaves you.
I think that’s something that people misrepresent about business.
Yeah.
I think I hold our field culpable for some of this misconception. Y’all are watching! I know some of you are doing this where you are selling like, “a seamless steady stream of clients for the rest of your life”. It’s like, hmm, nnnehhh.
It will always be ups and downs.
I said this before on the show but I can’t underscore this enough, that like, meet people, embed yourself with colleagues who are more successful than you. And people older, like 10, 20 years your senior, I think you start to see patterns of what their life is like, what success looks like, what they’re still fighting on, what they’ve let go, what laurels they are resting on what they’re not. I think you learn so much more from that than people posturing online that you don’t totally know if they’re successful or not.
Yeah.
There’s a lot of wisdom gleaned from what that next level of business looks like. What are they doing with their excess money? What does excess money look like? What investments look like? Are you angel investing? You’re buying more property? Are you reinvesting things in employees? Like I think there are new problems that happen as you reach later stages of business that resemble the ones you had before, right? When you’re still not above selling.
All right though, all the same problems just to get bigger the higher up, some will get smaller but some just get larger and more complicated the higher you go.
Do you watch Billions?
I do, yes.
Okay, so for anyone who watches this show, I’m a big fan, but there’s a great, it’s in season one, there was an episode where Axe has to go and do the pitching himself, and he is a billionaire. Literally, the show is called Billions and he’s at the stage where he’s just like I’m putting on a hoodie, I’m going to investor meetings.
I’m gonna remind them why we need that cash. So like you never graduate from that! He’s not sending his minions. Like he’s doing it. I know it’s a fictional character but like that’s the point.
Yeah, it’s easy to backslide and be like I should always be in the trenches because truly like as you get more and more successful, like should you stay in that visionary role
to a point? Absolutely.
Yeah.
The ability to go in and put on your hoodie and go to investor meetings and be able to roll up your sleeves and look and understand how the sausage is made in your business as well is super important. And that’s something that I often preach and have experienced in my own business where if I’m launching the first time, I’m usually, I mean I have my team, that I’m usually doing it myself now because I wanted to see how it’s done.
I think, again, there’s this vision of being a highly successful person where you just hire teams to do everything and then you’re on the beach in Hawaii and you never even look at your inbox anymore, and then you tweet a lot about how you never look at your inbox.
Meanwhile, you have an army of subcontractors trying to get a hold of you. Not that I’ve ever experienced that, but I think that the you’re not better than this mentality in a lot of ways, it helps you stay connected to your business in a way that allows you to be resilient and very present to the actual wins and losses that you’re experiencing.
And I think again, I have yet to reach that spot where I’m in Hawaii and annoying subcontractors with the fact that I don’t answer my email, but I have a feeling that if and when I get to that point, I’m still gonna wanna be at least in some capacity in the trenches because I think that connection is important.
And that might change.
We might have an episode in three years where we’re like well now Margo and I are gazillionaires and here we are on the beach in Hawaii. But I think that it goes both for the growth angle, humble yourself, and you’re not above this and also for the growth angle as you’re growing, and then as you’re continuing to scale and to build, don’t feel like you’re so good that you’re totally out of the business. That you don’t know what’s going on. Because I see that happen.
Yeah, I have actually been on the beach in Hawaii with many gazillionaires and they’re working full time. They’re working the whole time. They are not enjoying Hawaii. Let me tell you.
And I think that’s not necessarily what I wanna do either. you don’t always wanna be
chained to your business but I think that there’s like a middle ground. I know you have your Gary Vs, who’s like always working from the beach in Hawaii and he’s like trying to sell actively on the beach. But I think that for the rest of us, you can have boundaries, but in reality in order to be and stay successful, like keeping that line and that presence and that humbleness is essential.
Yeah, I’m speaking to myself here too. Like when that feeling of like you’re better than this comes up, interrogate it.
Yeah.
Because it’s usually something else that’s coming up. We were talking about in the beginning like you are afraid of defining yourself in a certain way. You’re uncomfortable with the pivot. Occasionally you’re uncomfortable with an actual tactic but usually, you’re uncomfortable with the perception of you being the person who uses that tactic.
Ding, ding, ding, ding ding! Yep.
It’s usually that, or it’s when you’re worried about what your colleagues think and not your customers or you’ve lost sight. So like usually something else is going on or it’s butting up against an invisible script. Like I said, a lot of us, I know a lot of my readers like me have an academic background where they were taught that asking for money is below them and it’s uncouth and it is not something respectable people do.
And like, you know the phrase, “shameless self-promotion”, like this is part of why Hillary and I encourage self-promotion. Like we want to. Here’s the thing. I had the most humbling experience with a few of my girlfriends who I perceived as way more successful than me, and they found out about something I launched and they were like why didn’t you tell us you were doing this?
Yeah.
And they were so hurt. They were like, we didn’t know you go on podcasts. We didn’t know you had a talk show. We didn’t know you did this, and I was like, first of all, get on my email list.
They’re right.
But like they were right there. Like, why don’t you tell your list that you do things? Like, why didn’t you tell us that you spoke at this event? Why don’t you tell us you sold this thing? Why don’t you tell us you were in that book? And like, I wasn’t, I really wasn’t because I was being falsely humble, and I think there’s a difference between true humility and being falsely humble because you’re afraid of being boastful.
Yeah.
And so the thing that fuels that feeling that you’re better than something, is that false humility.
Yeah.
It’s something else.
Yeah, and that’s the customers versus colleagues divide. It’s like, well, what are they? I don’t wanna be gauche. Like, people are hungry, they want to hear from you. People are hungry to buy from you and have you solve the problem that they have. But it does require you being uncomfortable and putting yourself out there a little bit.
Does that mean you have to use every bro marketing tactic under the sun? No, but maybe don’t throw the baby out with the bathwater on traditional marketing strategies to try and get your stuff out there and kind of figure out what works and what doesn’t for you.
So yeah, finding a way to make it work for you. Like using a tactic, maybe you don’t like it. Like maybe scarcity makes you uncomfortable, play with it. If you really are the salesperson, the business owner, the copywriter, the creative entrepreneur, like get creative with how you might use these tools and levers and pull them in a way that feels on-brand and then play.
Remember that, like, there’s not one tactic that’s gonna get you like cut from, like you’re not gonna lose all of your audience in one email, and if you do, that’s damn impressive, and we wanna see that email, like what happened there?
Yep.
No like truly, truly I think when that little voice comes up that says, ‘I’m better than this’. Interrogate it, figure out what’s going on, understand that there’s nothing that you’re better than, you might grow beyond things, as you move forward.
Yep.
A lot of us come from a certain indoctrination and acculturation to these beliefs that
we should be discovered, that business is below us, that transactions around money are crude and uncouth. Challenge these assumptions. Use what you’ve learned in lean startup, right? Identify the assumptions, challenge them, recognize that you’re not better than anything, and if that is coming up for you, figure out why. So Hillary, any last
thoughts before we close?
Yes, one more thing. Do not mistake exhausting yourself for generosity. We have a lot more we can dig into here and we’ll do a whole episode on generosity, and we have a whole episode on actually the serving by selling myth, go watch it. We dig a little bit more into this, but I would say especially when we’re in the better than that zone, and we consider ourselves generous and caring and in integrity.
We tend to give a lot of our time and attention away for free in the name of being generous and caring about our audience. When in reality, all that we’re doing is burning ourselves out and we deserve to be rewarded and compensated for our work. Should you be generous? Yes, but running yourself on the ground helps nobody.
Yes, all right. We are gonna talk more about that in a future episode. As it relates to feeling better than something, Hillary is a 1000%, right that this tends to be a consequential behavior to overcompensate for that feeling. Like “I’m not better than you. Watch me give you all these things,” and what that leads to is resentment.
Yeah.
You ended up resenting the people you seek to serve. Whereas you can actually honor
them by getting them to pay for the thing that you’ve worked really hard on. You honor yourself. So we’ll talk about that more in an upcoming episode that we might film right after this.
All right, so we want to hear from you what things did you feel better than? What things did you do that made you super uncomfortable? What things did you run away from? Because you were like, ‘people like me don’t do things like that’.
Let us know in the comments below. If you liked this episode, please like it below, subscribe to our channel and share it with your friends.
And really quickly y’all, before we get off Hillary and I are rushing to get to a thousand subscribers. So we really, really, really need your help. If you like our show, share it with your friends. Subscribe if you’re not already subscribed. Check on that button right somewhere.
It’s right down somewhere, go find it.
Help people to subscribe, peer pressure, everyone. We will call you out in a beautiful way. We will share all of our subscribers, and we hope to look at this in a year and be like, “Oh my God, only a thousand”. So help us get to that point. We are not better than selling to you.
Yes, we’re not. We are not better than asking you to subscribe.
That’s right, subscribe. If you like it, we love making it, we want to keep making it. So show up, tell us, let us know what you thought, anyway.
Tell your friends. Only the ones you like though.
Don’t send us your shit subscribers.
Don’t send us your shitty friends.
I’m Margo Aaron.
And I’m Hillary Wiess.
This has been HAMYAW and we will see you in two weeks.
Bye guys.
Photo by Juliet Clare Warren
